BYU now at #11

[ZOOMBAG]

And five nonBCS teams in the top 25. MWC with THREE top 25 teams.

I will continue to stick by my bet that BYU runs the table and not only gets the BCS bid but will play for the BCS championship against Southern Cal.

[FLORIDA HERD FAN]

Can't argue with that -- BYU is underrated.

[Hail to the Victors Valiant]

As byu's win would be more BCS rewarding than sexy due to the strength of their opponents, sneaking up to #2 is possible but the winner of the title games of the Big 12 or SEC are more likely to seal the spot. Mizzou, okl, tex, lsu, georgia and florida with 1 loss should have higher bcs score than an undefeated byu. And the 1-point win at a weak Wash team will end up hurting their case. Nonetheless, byu is spanking people mercilessly and a rose bowl spot against the Big 10 champ could be there destiny.

[HellYeahHokie]

I will continue to stick by my bet that BYU runs the table and not only gets the BCS bid but will play for the BCS championship against Southern Cal.

No, no, no. That's can't happen. Haven't you been paying attention. The system makes it impossible for a non-BCS school to ever make the BCS championship game.

Try to keep up.

[Blue Hen]

I'm not joking, like HYH
It will not happen. The system is designed to prevent anything like that.

If I'm wrong , nominate this post for dumbth of the year.

(hope I'm wrong, but I'll believe it when I see it)

[CJHawkeyes]

No, no, no. That's can't happen. Haven't you been paying attention. The system makes it impossible for a non-BCS school to ever make the BCS championship game.

Try to keep up.


So, if a second mid-major in 31 years of the FBS reaches the top two, the system is fair?

[GatorGrad]

So, if a second mid-major in 31 years of the FBS reaches the top two, the system is fair?

CJ - Out of curiosity, how many FBS teams would have finished in the top two using your system in the last 31 years?

[CJHawkeyes]

CJ - Out of curiosity, how many FBS teams would have finished in the top two using your system in the last 31 years?

Well, only two did and both occurred in the statistically weakest years at the top. Of course, I suspect things could have been much different if my idea actually had any influence during that time. Certainly, things would not have been the same. I often hear someone argue that because the polls and computers agree so much that perhaps the polls aren't really biased. The problem is that the results of the various computers, while judging actual results, aren't actually influencing college football like polls do. No one would make the same choices if influenced by an idea like mine and I truly believe the two class system would disappear if college football teams were governed by objective rules. That doesn't mean that the conferences will ever be equally good, but I think a nonBCS team finishing in the top two would happen more than twice in 31 years.

[EvilVodka]

As byu's win would be more BCS rewarding than sexy due to the strength of their opponents, sneaking up to #2 is possible but the winner of the title games of the Big 12 or SEC are more likely to seal the spot. Mizzou, okl, tex, lsu, georgia and florida with 1 loss should have higher bcs score than an undefeated byu. And the 1-point win at a weak Wash team will end up hurting their case. Nonetheless, byu is spanking people mercilessly and a rose bowl spot against the Big 10 champ could be there destiny.

I also think BYU needs a 2-loss Big XII and SEC Champ...

The Mountain West looks really good though, and BYU is in a great position to keep moving up...

An off-the-radar game that could really push BYU up later on is TCU vs. Oklahoma...if BYU beats an undefeated TCU team that beat #2 Oklahoma, then they've got an excellent chance to play for it all IMO

All in all, they've got a chance, but they need help

[Lincoln Tower]

Notice: every response in this thread has been in agreement that BYU is good and has a very good shot at going undefeated.

Prediction: if BYU does go undefeated, ZOOM will spin it like he was the only one who "believed" in BYU and the rest of the board was "against him".

[HellYeahHokie]

So, if a second mid-major in 31 years of the FBS reaches the top two, the system is fair?

I never said it was fair. But what is 'fair' anyway? Even if we used your system, would it be fair that a school with virtually unlimited resources like USC would have an advantage over a school like Rice?

You'll never have fair. You might have more fair with a different system, but until you give every school the same resources, the same facilities, and the same schedules, you'll never have fair...and of course, that wouldn't even be fair .

But we do have a system that does allow a school from a non-BCS conference to go the MNC game, even if Hen refuses to believe it.

[CJHawkeyes]

I never said it was fair. But what is 'fair' anyway? Even if we used your system, would it be fair that a school with virtually unlimited resources like USC would have an advantage over a school like Rice?

You'll never have fair. You might have more fair with a different system, but until you give every school the same resources, the same facilities, and the same schedules, you'll never have fair...and of course, that wouldn't even be fair .

But we do have a system that does allow a school from a non-BCS conference to go the MNC game, even if Hen refuses to believe it.

Certainly, some schools are going to have intangible advantages that cannot be accounted for. However, those advantages are nothing like having actual competition rules that are lopsided in favor of one group. The fact that a nonBCS team in the MNC title game is mathematically possible means what given the odds that must be overcome for that to occur?

[Bucs90]

I'm not joking, like HYH
It will not happen. The system is designed to prevent anything like that.

If I'm wrong , nominate this post for dumbth of the year.

(hope I'm wrong, but I'll believe it when I see it)

I hope BYU does make it. They have an outstanding team. They could. The SEC is extremely top-heavy, but very very strong at the top 5-6 teams, and they will put a loss on each other. Don't see anyone coming out undefeated in Big Ten (are there any left without a loss now?). ACC no one is coming out without a loss, as Clemson and Wake appear to be top 2 in ACC. Big 12 could have OU and Mizzou make a run, but who knows. I think BYU has a shot.

[EvilVodka]

I hope BYU does make it. They have an outstanding team. They could. The SEC is extremely top-heavy, but very very strong at the top 5-6 teams, and they will put a loss on each other. Don't see anyone coming out undefeated in Big Ten (are there any left without a loss now?). ACC no one is coming out without a loss, as Clemson and Wake appear to be top 2 in ACC. Big 12 could have OU and Mizzou make a run, but who knows. I think BYU has a shot.

BYU really needs the SEC and the Big XII to eat each other...

Of course, when I picture all of these championship scenarios in my mind, I have USC in every one as default...they'd have to come up with a heck of a choke job to not be in the game this year...

[Jim]

Remember back in 1984 when they beat Michigan (a 6-5 team) in the Holiday Bowl, 24-17. The only major undefeated and untied team resulted in a National Championship. Notice how nobody selected them to play in a major bowl (Cotton, Sugar or Orange) which had just one auto-bid each (Cotton - SWC, Sugar- SEC and Orange - Big Eight)?

As impressed as I am with the Cougars I don't feel that Georgia, LSU, Florida and Alabama will be surpassed by BYU unless the SEC champ loses two games. Look at last year - a two loss LSU went to the BCS title game. Hawaii made it to the BCS but even though unbeaten didn't get the nod and got blown out by Georgia, 41-10.

I think that out of the nine teams that separate them from USC, one of them will be selected opposite USC. I feel reasonably certain that at least one of those teams, if not undefeated themselves, will have at most a single loss. It would help BYU if that team with a single loss lost it in their conference title game. Then we'd have a conference champion, an undefeated BYU challenging an at-large team rather than a conference champion.

I feel it is time for the Mountain West to get its own auto-bid to a BCS bowl and that bowl ought to be the Fiesta Bowl. Rather than piggy-backing the BCS title game onto one of the existing four BCS sites they ought to assign the Big XII champion to the Cotton Bowl in the greater Dallas area. The midlands ought to get to keep their own monies rather than dropping huge sums in Miami (in the past) or out in Arizona.

[Hail to the Victors Valiant]

Someone may have posted that unless wins the Big 10, USC could get surpassed by both the champ of the B12 and SEC if the competing teams finish with the same # of losses as the Pac 10 may not hold its own in the computer models. However, BYU likely still needs 2 of these teams to have 2 losses each unless, as Evil aptly pointed out, BYU defeats TCU which beats OKL.

[ZOOMBAG]

BYU started #15, Hawaii started #23. Hawaii played two Div IAA (just can't go with the silliness of FBS, FCS, whatever), BYU has played non. Even that great 2000 Miami team had a close one at 2-9 BC that year. Add to that the MWC is orders of magnitude tougher than the WAC was last year. Currently THREE top 25 teams in the MWC, and AFA game #18 Utah all it could handle and may also end up ranked by year's end.

They need some very timely help, just like they did in 1984. And this time they only need to get to #2, not #1 and they are already #11. Hawaii never even made to #11 until the very end.

They need to be undefeated and sitting at least #4 going into championship week, then need two favorites to lose there.

[ZOOMBAG]

I have yet to see anyone but me actually PREDICT it, though, just that it is within the realm of possibility. And remember, I predicted in the preseason.

[Blue Hen]

You're dreamin, Zoom. Fox TV doesn't want an off brand like BYU playing in the BCS pretend NC game. The pollsters won't let it happen and the six BCS auto qualifer leagues don't want it. It's dead. The official two class system 'line in the sand' was drawn in 1998 and BYU is on the wrong side of the line.

[HellYeahHokie]

I don't know about that. BYU has some tradition and history on it's side. It's not like Boise State showing up out of nowhere. BYU is a well-established and respected program, but on the outside looking in of the BCS mix. I'm sure the BCS leagues don't want it to happen, but I'm not so sure about the voters.

If any team was to break the BCS bubble, a team like BYU would be ideal. And even if the BCS leagues took a financial hit by the money going outside the 'cartel', I think they could always say "See! BYU did it. So don't bother with your lawsuits and other such complaining"

[CJHawkeyes]

"See! BYU did it. So don't bother with your lawsuits and other such complaining"

NonBCS schools would be stupid to fall for that. Then again, they do not appear smart enough to understand what is it their best interest anyway.

[HellYeahHokie]

And five nonBCS teams in the top 25. MWC with THREE top 25 teams.

I will continue to stick by my bet that BYU runs the table and not only gets the BCS bid but will play for the BCS championship against Southern Cal.

Fall for it or not, I'm guessing it would prove some legal merit that the system is not exclusive, if this ever went to court, or in front of Congress. In fact, most of that talk went away when the BCS expanded to 5 games and allowed the non-BCS schools to get some of the cash.

[CJHawkeyes]

Fall for it or not, I'm guessing it would prove some legal merit that the system is not exclusive, if this ever went to court, or in front of Congress. In fact, most of that talk went away when the BCS expanded to 5 games and allowed the non-BCS schools to get some of the cash.

I think talk went away when the BCS expanded because nonBCS officials were willing to settle for table scraps either because they believe they scored big or are afraid to challenge for more. The fact that they aren't smart enough to push for rules that are completely open and objective proves as much to me.

That said, I'm certainly no legal scholar, but I wonder if the BCS ranked teams by their records after assessing nonBCS schools a one game penalty, if this setup would be legal simply because it is still possible for a nonBCS school to reach the top two. The differences between this setup and the actual one is that nonBCS teams would have fared better under the former and the latter's lopsided nature is disguised by its lack of transparency. Even if a nonBCS team eventually makes the title game, it will only happen because every other BCS team lost once if not twice. After all, 1984 BYU is the only undefeated mid-major in 30 years to finish the regular season ranked higher than all teams with more losses.