OT: Bonds hits #741

[TommyTrojan]

Okay....he's 42 years old, clearly not on steriods (if you beileve he ever was) and has 7 HR's on the season, all the while taking himself out of many games, late in the game.

He's the best ever. Period.

That is all....:)

[Blue Hen]

Ruth was best ever.........and amazingly , powered by performance dehancing substances and life style)

[jeff4bucks]

have to agree with Hen.
Bonds may not be on 'a program' now, but it is fairly obvious he was at some point. The great irony is that he never really needed them. He was a great player back in the early 90s, preceeding the steroid era.
Though, it is impressive what Bonds is doing this season, as well as ARod...

[TommyTrojan]

ARod, barring injury, will have the HR record at some point. He is so locked in right now, but consider the protection he has in his lineup (Giambi) and what Ruth had (Gehrig). Bonds isn't so fortunate, and for that seems only a handfull of good pitches a game.

I know I'm in the minority, but I'll take Barry Bonds over Ruth.

[FLORIDA HERD FAN]

I couldn't disagree more.

Just like Mark McGwire, Bonds did need and did use performance-enhancing drugs. McGwire's and Bonds' records are bogus. Sammy Sosa's records are likely bogus as well.

Bonds is not assaulting the home run record. Rather, he has already assaulted the integrity of the game. The Major League Baseball Players Association, the team owners and the commissioner knowingly allowed this to happen.

Bonds participated in a scandal that far surpasses the Black Sox scandal. The sad fact is that the damage to the game cannot be undone. No records since the days of Aaron and Mays can be trusted.

[Blue Hen]

Excellent point about lineup protection. Bonds is an athletic wonder, no doubt....arguably the quickest bat of all time but Ruth was far, far, more dominant relative to his era. I think discussing all time baseball greats is about as much fun as sports forums get. So TT, give me your all time ball team, position by position, including 3 RH and 3 LH pitchers.

Mine :

C- Josh Gibson/Johnny Bench
1B - Lou Gehrig/Stan Musial
2B - Rogers Hornsby/Joe Morgan
3B - Mike Schmidt
SS -Honus Wagner ( although A-Rod could slide in here or at 3b in time)
LF - Ted Williams/Barry Bonds
CF - Willie Mays/Ty Cobb/Oscar Charleston
RF - Babe Ruth/Henry Aaron

RHP - Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson ,Bob Gibson
LHP - Sandy Koufax, Steve Carlton, Warren Spahn

[HellYeahHokie]

Get out of town with Mike Schmidt at 3rd base. The hot corner belongs to the human vacuume cleaner, Brooks Robinison. Schmidt would be my 2nd choice, but it was Robinson that completely redefined the position.

[Blue Hen]

I liked Brooks but every all time team has Schmidt way ahead of Brooks. Actually, Wade Boggs , George Brett, Frank Baker, Pie Traynor, Eddie Matthews might be more arguable than Brooksie, simply because they were so much better ,offensively. Brooks was a great glove but so was Schmidt. He won 10 'Gold Gloves', 2nd all time to Robinson's 16.
..but as batters consider this : Robinson played 23 years, Schmidt played 18.
Yet...Schmidt had 280 more HRs, 238 more RBIs, and 142 more SBs. They had identical .267 lifetime BAs. Schmidt was a 3 time MVP, Robinson won a single MVP.

The Sporting News recently published a book entitled 'Baseball's 100 Greatest Players'. Mike Schmidt is the 28th greatest ball player of all time and Brooks Robinson is the 80th greatest of all time, according to those guys.


A quote from that book - " No third baseman in the game's long history could match the near perfect blend of defense, run production, and speed that Mike Schmidt showcased during a Hall Of Fame Career"

[TommyTrojan]

Excellent point about lineup protection. Bonds is an athletic wonder, no doubt....arguably the quickest bat of all time but Ruth was far, far, more dominant relative to his era. I think discussing all time baseball greats is about as much fun as sports forums get. So TT, give me your all time ball team, position by position, including 3 RH and 3 LH pitchers.

Mine :

C- Josh Gibson/Johnny Bench
1B - Lou Gehrig/Stan Musial
2B - Rogers Hornsby/Joe Morgan
3B - Mike Schmidt
SS -Honus Wagner ( although A-Rod could slide in here or at 3b in time)
LF - Ted Williams/Barry Bonds
CF - Willie Mays/Ty Cobb/Oscar Charleston
RF - Babe Ruth/Henry Aaron

RHP - Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson ,Bob Gibson
LHP - Sandy Koufax, Steve Carlton, Warren Spahn

That's a great team HH, I don't think we'll have many different selections.

My starting outfield
LF - Bonds, CF - Cobb, RF - Ruth
*If Cobb played in the live ball era who knows what those numbers look like.

3B - Mike Schmitt :I don't know what HYH is smokin ;) Power #' are way ahead of Robinson.
SS - A-Rod
2B & 1B Ill take all the same guys as you.
C - I like Johnny Bench. I need more verification on what Gibson's #'s really are. Piazza, Pudge I & II are also great choices. Based soley on hitting, I ll go with Piazza.

RHP - I got Clemons and Walter Johnson
LHP - Koufax is #1 for sure IMO. Carlton and the Big Unit are next on my team.

Not a lot of differences.

[HellYeahHokie]

But I grew up an Orioles fan. You'll never convince me otherwise.

Besides, Schmidt played in the sissy National league. Anyone could get his numbers there.

[Blue Hen]

Our 26 man rosters would be pretty close, I think. Josh Gibson's #s are surely 'fuzzy' , typical of the Negro Leaguers, but based on accounts from peers , including major leaguers, Gibson was at least equal to Ruth as an overwhelming power hitter...and I forgot about Satchel Paige. He'd be on my pitching staff, for sure. Fun stuff, TT

[Blue Hen]

heheeee

I grew up halfway between Baltimore and Philly and loved both teams. I idolized Richie Ashburn as a young kid ( yeah, I'm that old ) but naming Brooks as the all time greatest third baseman would be like naming Ashburn the all time greatest CFer....but Brooks was one of my personal all time favorites. What a classy guy !